top range ninja sword

[vrninja]

ok i have looked at the paul chen again has i have owned one but the handel hairlined on me so time for a new one i looked around for a higher spec sword
and i found this
http://www.gengswords.co.nz/84.asp

any help or knowleg of the best ninja type sword out there would be great

[Brian Brazier]

A real Ninja Sword is much like a Samurai Sword, with the exeption of the Shinobi style that has a shorter blade with a long saya, if you want a the most realistic Ninja Sword out there Cheness makes the Oniyuri http://www.chenessinc.com/9260oniyuri.htm, but for a Hollywood Ninja Sword the Chen is very good for the price (not sure what you mean by the handle harirlined, does the tsuka have a hairline crack inside? If so you can repair that), as for the Geng Swords one, I have no experiance with them, but it seems to me that it is very overpriced. For $700 I would expect a straight sword to have either high quality leather or silk tsuka-ito, also the saya to have the Koiguchi and Kurikata made from Buffalo Horn.

[vrninja]

thank you for your replai
first yes the handle hairlined well i shudent say hairline more split in two lol

yes its the Shinobi style katana not the hollywood special that im after thats my own fault for not wording things properly

and last im looking for some thing in the middle to high range i want to spend about £500-700 i think thats about 1000-1250 dollers on a sword this will be a stop gap sword has im saveing for a shinsakuto but i have another 2 years saveing to do has i want to spend about £10000 pounds which is once again about $20000

the options i was looking at was find a fully built or buy the best and use the rest of the money to custamiz the sword to a higher standerd for now
ref the sword i need a long tsuka and short blade and long saya has thats the draw style that i am use to

thank you for your time and help:)

[Mako]

Live rates at 2007.10.07 18:09:14 UTC $700.00 NZD=£261.271 GBP
Assuming that the price quoted is in New Zealand Dollars of course.
You'll have to pay Shipping plus Import Duty,VAT and handling charge on top,so add approx 22% to the total including the Shipping charge but I guess you know that already.;)

[vrninja]

like i said mu buget for this is 1000 GBP thats why i have posted on here has all the shinobi swords about seem cheap that i can find
i do lot of cutting drills to so im a bit stuck has what to go for i have studied ninjitsu for 22 years and have a family katana but i wont be useing that for training in this life time
i dont want to use my shinsakuto saveings henc the buget so any pointers or advice would be great thanks like i said even if i buy best i can get my hands on then get it upgraded

this sword needs to last 3 years max has 2 years time i will placeing my order and it can take up to a year for the sword to be made

[Brian Brazier]

the Cheness 9260 steel is very tough, and should be a very good dojo cutter, I know Paul who has the SBG Forum and Store carries allot of the Cheness stuff and he is in Australia, like you said you could pick one of the Oniyuri Shinobi Katana's up and spend the rest you had on better ito or furniture. I also think Oni Forge has a Shinobi Katana http://www.oniforge.com/3201.html I have heard very good things about both of these, but if I had my choice I would go with the Oni Forge, just because I have heard better things about their fit and finish, in fact I have been thinking of getting one for some time but I spent all my sword budget for a while, please leave a review of whatever you end up with

[vrninja]

I will do a full review and let you all know im in the uk so im trying to find some one to do the fittings has i would like the fittings in silver and gold . A leather tsuka and to make sure that it's a full rayskin rap and not strips the oni forge is looking the fav at the moment i must say

[Dotanuki]

Actually if you wanted a authentic ninja sword go buy yourself a cheap wakizashi, because that is what most ninja's would have had availible at the time.
Remember just because they claim there is no historical evidence of a Hollywood ninja sword still doesn't mean they didn't exist [mistakes have been made before]. There has always been people discrediting anything to do with shinobi swordsmanship. The current 'official' ninja blade is unique to the Bujinkan and it's successors. The Bujinkan sword techniques are often quite unique and different from standard Kenjutsu. But if you remember early Bujinkan practioners were using the 'Hollywood' blade as a norm.
Also remember no straight bladed sword [ninja, cane sword] will stand up to the rigors of tameshigiri on a regular basis. If you want to cut you should use the appropiate blade, unless you like replacing swords or don't care.
Too often we get caught up in the idea and not the reality.

[vrninja]

i ave a family katana were the blade is straight but its very long 29 inch and the handel is long to 13 inch i have studied koga ninpo ninjitsu for 22 years now i was taught by my dad i have never used my sword has its very old 1612 but i have trained with shorter blades but the same lenth handels has that is what my family style is has we were mors battle field than covert henc the long blade and straight was for stabing horse back riders and samurai in there armoure

[Brian Brazier]

If I remember correctly there are "straight" swords at the Iga Ninja Museum in Japan, my cousin showed me pictures he took there. I think the reason that the Ninja Sword has taken upon this straight sword is that a some of the Ninja Swords have very little Sori, which makes them appear to be straight, similar to this http://www.iganinja.jp/english/budou/buki/f-buki.html this is from the Iga Ninja Museum website. If for some reason the pic dosent come up here it is
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t97/bbrazierkendo/iga.gif

[Brian Brazier]

Like Dotanuki said, most Ninja Swords were Wakizashi or cut down Katana's, the Shinobigata usually had Katana fittings (Tsuba, Tsuka, etc)

[vrninja]

the tsuba on my family sword is round with a bamboo looking forest of some sort and a mountine in the back ground and looks like its made out of iron there are no holes or gapes in it the saya is a very dull black almost not polished dont know if this is due to age or how it was made it is ray skin rap but no ornament under it it with a black cotton rap the fitings look almost blue black with a funny patern that looks like it natruel from the metal but the blade looks almost bone stright and has a very long handel i put the messument in my last post i think

this is the first time i have realy looked close at it has i only touch it to clean it and put it back on its stand for 6 monthes till it gets cleaned again

:) what im looking for is just a high qulity blade has i know some one who will do all the fiiting for me

[Brian Brazier]

The reason your Saya is dull looking is probably because of the style finish it has, there are two basic finish styles for Saya's, Kuroishime (dull), and Kuroro (shiny). If you just want a bare blade for a Shinobigatana, the Cheness 9260 Wakizashi Shirasaya http://www.chenessinc.com/9260thshirasaya_wak.htm, that way you can have someone finish it how you want it, and you will have a nice unfinished saya (Shirasaya) that is great for long term storage. You would have to make or have someone make a Katana lenght Saya for it to be a Shinobigatana. The one thing I must stress for your safety and the safety of those around you, is you cannot use a Shirasaya like a Katana until it is finished with a proper mekugi, that means no cutting, swinging, or general practice. The reason is because a Shirasaya isn't meant to be a sword, it is a blade carrier (like a case for the bare blade). Once the tsuka, is finished with a proper bamboo mekugi, then feel free to cut, and practice all you want.

[Brian Brazier]

Also Kris Cutlery has great Wakizashi II http://kriscutlery.com/japanese/wakizashiII.htm, though not a bare blade, it is a great deal, has black same on the tsuka, and buffalo horn on the saya. Kris Cutlery Katana's are well known for being very tough, and great performing swords, not always the best looking furniture, but if you are going to change all that then who cares. Again you would have to have someone make you a Katana length Saya, but if you know someone who does the furniture, they probably can do a Saya as well. Both of the afore mentioned Wakizashi should be great performance wise, and if well taken care of, should last a long time

[Mako]

Note the sugata of the Momoyama period katana,it has very little sori and if shortened to chisa-katana would appear almost straight.

http://home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/sugata/shape.htm

I wouldn't recommend using anything in Shirasaya mount for cutting,regardless of the quality of mekugi...tsuka weren't fitted with a fuchi,kashira,fully wrapped and glued in samegawa then very tightly bound with silk tsuka-ito just to make them look good.;)

[Brian Brazier]

Note the sugata of the Momoyama period katana,it has very little sori and if shortened to chisa-katana would appear almost straight.

http://home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/sugata/shape.htm

I wouldn't recommend using anything in Shirasaya mount for cutting,regardless of the quality of mekugi...tsuka weren't fitted with a fuchi,kashira,fully wrapped and glued in samegawa then very tightly bound with silk tsuka-ito just to make them look good.;)

Mako, checkout this conversation I had with a guy on SBG about Shirasaya http://sbgswordforum.proboards70.com/index.cgi?board=japaneseswords&action=display&thread=1188501702&page=1, he asked for help and advise but wouldn't take any

VRNINJA
if you really want something custom check this out http://www.arscives.com/bladesignnew/jefflarsen_wakizashimaking.htm just make your own :dwarf:. I really wish I had a house so I could start my own little forge in the backyard.

[vrninja]

ahh so it looks like my sword is from momoyama times i cant ask my dad has he's not around anymore bless him so i dident get a chance to go into detail about or family history

ref shirasaya i am full aware i have been useing katana from the age of 8 so i do know my way around swords but i just dont know whats on the market has you guys have said there is a lot of rubbish going about claiming to be high qulity when they are not
p.s im not trying to sound of plz dont take it that way

ref the last few posts i thank you for your help the guy i know is going to make the fittings for my sword and at 650 GBP is not a bad price so im gona spend about 800 GBP on just a blade

[Mako]

Mako, checkout this conversation I had with a guy on SBG about Shirasaya http://sbgswordforum.proboards70.com/index.cgi?board=japaneseswords&action=display&thread=1188501702&page=1, he asked for help and advise but wouldn't take any

Which one is you Brian :-?

ahh so it looks like my sword is from momoyama times

Only just if it's dated 1612...who made it?
A pic of the blade along with with a close up of the mei would be very interesting.

[Brian Brazier]

Which one is you Brian :-?



Only just if it's dated 1612...who made it?
A pic of the blade along with with a close up of the mei would be very interesting.


Oops guess that would help, I am Big B


VRNINJA, I too would like to see some pics of your family sword

[vrninja]

i will try and borrow a camera and get some done this weekend for you all :)

[Mako]

Oops guess that would help, I am Big B
Looks like we're in agreement then Brian and I've misunderstood this...

Once the tsuka, is finished with a proper bamboo mekugi, then feel free to cut, and practice all you want.


i will try and borrow a camera and get some done this weekend for you all :)
Great...in the meantime...who made it?

[vrninja]

i havent got a clue my dad said it was from 1612 so look after it has its been handed down thru the family since so i need to do a bit of family tree work i think i would like to know more about my family too

[Mako]

What part of the U.K. are you from?
There are some good sites for tracing your family history including Counties with message boards that may be able to help you.
I've gone back to circa 1660 with my paternal side and circa 1750 on my maternal side to date and did it all via the 'net.:>